Any Reason Not To Squat Really Deep?

[dawaro]

Is there any reason why you would not want to squat really deep? When I am warming up I usually low enough my butt is on the ground. Before the weights progressed I was doing this on my working sets and it felt like I had a more explosive movement out of the hole. In fact I did not start having troubles with the weights until I started going to just under parallel.
I am on my first squat deload and if there are not any negative reasons I would like to return to going as low as possible.
Opinions??

[ukdudeinuk]

If you don't squat below parallel, you build a strength imbalance. Below parallel works your posterior chain, which keeps the muscle balance in your leg in check, and prevents knee problems.

[Mehdi]

Is there any reason why you would not want to squat really deep? When I am warming up I usually low enough my butt is on the ground. Before the weights progressed I was doing this on my working sets and it felt like I had a more explosive movement out of the hole. In fact I did not start having troubles with the weights until I started going to just under parallel.
I am on my first squat deload and if there are not any negative reasons I would like to return to going as low as possible.
Opinions??

You can use more weight when going just below parallel compared to when going atg. For a low bar squat, atg doesn't work well.

[Young Athlete]

Anything wrong with high bar+ATG. I love how natural it feels to go so low as people stare as I take lower the safety pins.

[Edziu]

Well, I know I'm about to get all the rotten fruit thrown at me but let me have my say. There is a considerable body of opinion that low squats put a lot of stress on the knees. Having said that though, I'm gradually lowering my squat to get more posterior chain involvement. Still, I'm really reluctant to go much lower - Instead I go to just below parallel and do extra glute ham raises to pick up the slack. No problems so far.
OK OK I'm ready for all the stinky rotten fruit now

[dawaro]

If you don't squat below parallel, you build a strength imbalance. Below parallel works your posterior chain, which keeps the muscle balance in your leg in check, and prevents knee problems.

I think you missed the point of my post. Squatting below parallel is not in question. What I was asking about was going way below parallel.

[dawaro]

Well, I know I'm about to get all the rotten fruit thrown at me but let me have my say. There is a considerable body of opinion that low squats put a lot of stress on the knees. Having said that though, I'm gradually lowering my squat to get more posterior chain involvement. Still, I'm really reluctant to go much lower - Instead I go to just below parallel and do extra glute ham raises to pick up the slack. No problems so far.
OK OK I'm ready for all the stinky rotten fruit now

Here comes the first piece...just kidding. In all seriousness though I think you will find the people that make up that body of opinion do not squat or if they do it is no where near a full squat. Although I have only been doing the stronglift's 5x5 for 6 weeks I have always done squats and deadlifts. You will see it recomended over and over here but reading the Starting Strength book will give you the basic understanding of the body's mechanics and show you why this opinion is flawed. One of the easiest ways you can prove the benefits of full squats is to take measurements, not on your thighs but on the knee itself. As your strength increases so will the muscle mass that supports the knee. More muscle more stability.
I had reconstructive surgery on one of my knees 12 years ago for torn cartillage and a tendon. Even after surgery I continued to have problems with it. After a few months of full squats the problems where almost non-existant. I have been deep squating for over a year above my body weight and closer to 1.5xbw with no pain or stability issues.
If you really want to do something that will reak havoc on the knees try what most do because they believe squats are bad for the knees,leg extensions.

[dawaro]

For a low bar squat, atg doesn't work well.

I know you are taxed for time but if you get a chance can you go into the details of "why"? I am not questioning your advice just seeking the knowledge to understand it more.

[Mehdi]

For a low bar squat, atg doesn't work well.

I know you are taxed for time but if you get a chance can you go into the details of "why"? I am not questioning your advice just seeking the knowledge to understand it more.

No problem, happy to explain. It's easier to go deep when your torso is more upright like on a front squat/oh squat/olympic squat. With a low bar squat, you lean forward more.

[Mehdi]

Well, I know I'm about to get all the rotten fruit thrown at me but let me have my say. There is a considerable body of opinion that low squats put a lot of stress on the knees. Having said that though, I'm gradually lowering my squat to get more posterior chain involvement. Still, I'm really reluctant to go much lower - Instead I go to just below parallel and do extra glute ham raises to pick up the slack. No problems so far.
OK OK I'm ready for all the stinky rotten fruit now

We had this conversation before. I'm curious who tells you that/where you have this from?

[dawaro]

For a low bar squat, atg doesn't work well.

I know you are taxed for time but if you get a chance can you go into the details of "why"? I am not questioning your advice just seeking the knowledge to understand it more.

No problem, happy to explain. It's easier to go deep when your torso is more upright like on a front squat/oh squat/olympic squat. With a low bar squat, you lean forward more.

I see your point. In fact I think this may have been what was causing me to lean forward coming out of the hole. Makes sense that if I am already leaning forward from going to deep on the way down that the motion would be the same on the way up.
Since you mention the front squats I have been meaning to ask you about the 5x5II program. With the release of the intermidiate program last week do you no longer recommend the 5x5II program after the beginner? I was really looking forward to the front squats in the 5x5II.

[Edziu]

We had this conversation before. I'm curious who tells you that/where you have this from?

Well, trainers in the gym, martial arts instructors and various internet sites. Although, since our last conversation, I have done a bit more research and I'd like to change my position to 'deep squats with poor technique and too much weight can damage knees.' But then again, I've heard nothing bad about squatting to parallel...

[Edziu]

I had reconstructive surgery on one of my knees 12 years ago for torn cartillage and a tendon. Even after surgery I continued to have problems with it. After a few months of full squats the problems where almost non-existant. I have been deep squating for over a year above my body weight and closer to 1.5xbw with no pain or stability issues.

Good to hear it. Did someone show you the technique before you started?

If you really want to do something that will reak havoc on the knees try what most do because they believe squats are bad for the knees,leg extensions.

Amen to that. I tried it a few times and felt my knees aching far more than squats

[Mehdi]

I see your point. In fact I think this may have been what was causing me to lean forward coming out of the hole. Makes sense that if I am already leaning forward from going to deep on the way down that the motion would be the same on the way up.
Since you mention the front squats I have been meaning to ask you about the 5x5II program. With the release of the intermidiate program last week do you no longer recommend the 5x5II program after the beginner? I was really looking forward to the front squats in the 5x5II.

Better to jump straight in to stronglifts 5x5 advanced or any other intermediate program. I'm removing the btsp2 program in the coming weeks;

[Mikeone356]

I've read that one should not squat below the point where hams press against the calves as this creates a pulling apart force and that will cause damage to the knees.