Intermediate 5x5 program question

[siimon89]

Right now I'm on the Rippetoe Starting Strength for the 4th week.

My stats are now:

Squat: 103kg x 5
Bench: 70kg x 5
Military Press: 48kg x 5
Deadlift 85kg x 5
Power Clean 60kg x 3

Bodyweight: 80kg

Today when doing squats, I failed on 105kg. Couldn't do it at all. This is my first stall period though and I will have a slight back off period now for squats (10% red.) and work my way up until I stall again.

My question is, after I've stalled twice, I'm planning on moving on to another 5x5 program since I really love the concept, though I'm not sure which program would suit me best. I want to be able to develop my Power Clean and Squats as much as possible, and also keep chins/pull-ups as an assistance exercise.

I like the Madcow concept, but I don't like adding biceps curls and triceps extensions and not using chins at all.

Any thoughts on which program would suit me best?

[Wellhairedbeast]

Keep with SS, if you keep making linear gains don't change the program it will only slow your progress. And as SS is 3x5 you should in theory progress quicker than with a 5x5 (one of the reasons people move to 3x5 on some exercises in SL after some time).

At your current weights you have a way to go, and SS will take you there, if it doesnt get you to 1.5bw squat then your not eating and resting enough.

[siimon89]

Keep with SS, if you keep making linear gains don't change the program it will only slow your progress. And as SS is 3x5 you should in theory progress quicker than with a 5x5 (one of the reasons people move to 3x5 on some exercises in SL after some time).

At your current weights you have a way to go, and SS will take you there, if it doesnt get you to 1.5bw squat then your not eating and resting enough.

Well, it says in the SS book that after stalling twice you should think consider to move on to a intermediate program. And of course I want to progress with SS for as long as possible. I cut down on the milk these last days, that could actually be one of the reasons why I failed today.

Are you talking about 1,5bw 5x5 or 1x1? 103kg x 1.2= 123kg 1RM using a lifting-calculator.

[atypical1]

Stalling after 4 weeks means that you either started too heavy or have other factors. I agree with WHB that you're either not eating or not resting enough.

How much do you weigh and how many calories are you getting? What's the breakdown of the calories you're getting?

james

[siimon89]

Stalling after 4 weeks means that you either started too heavy or have other factors. I agree with WHB that you're either not eating or not resting enough.

How much do you weigh and how many calories are you getting? What's the breakdown of the calories you're getting?

james

I thought I kept everything with recovery good. I do lots of foam rolling, tennis ball release and stretching on the recovery days as well as eating a lot.

I weigh 80kg. I don't count calories, so I have no idea.. But I have gained a couple of kgs the last 4weeks so I'm doing something right.

[atypical1]

If you don't know how many calories you're getting then moving onto an intermediate program won't do you much good. That should be the first thing you check. You don't need to do this everyday but you should do it often enough so that you have a rough idea of how many calories you are getting each day.

james

[siimon89]

If you don't know how many calories you're getting then moving onto an intermediate program won't do you much good. That should be the first thing you check. You don't need to do this everyday but you should do it often enough so that you have a rough idea of how many calories you are getting each day.

james

As I already wrote, my plan isn't to move on already cause I do of course want to keep getting these fast gains as on the Novice program.
My question was which program to consider later after stalling twice. But since we're on it, is stalling on 105kg (did 103kgx3x5 this Monday) at a bodyweight of 80kg too early, meaning I did something wrong with the recovery?

[atypical1]

Something is wrong somewhere if you're stalling that quickly. You should be making progress well past the 4 week mark. I don't really know enough about you to make many recommendations above the basic "watch your diet and your rest". How long have you been lifting? You say you started this program 4 weeks ago, what weights did you start with? What program did you do before this?

What does your current workout look like? My recommendation would be to start a log and put all of this information into it. Then you have access to a lot of really good opinions because it will be based off of a lot more information than we currently have.

james

[siimon89]

Something is wrong somewhere if you're stalling that quickly. You should be making progress well past the 4 week mark. I don't really know enough about you to make many recommendations above the basic "watch your diet and your rest". How long have you been lifting? You say you started this program 4 weeks ago, what weights did you start with? What program did you do before this?

What does your current workout look like? My recommendation would be to start a log and put all of this information into it. Then you have access to a lot of really good opinions because it will be based off of a lot more information than we currently have.

james

Oh, okey! Good to know, thanks Then I don't have to be sad that the gains are starting to stall.
I started squatting and barbell training May 2009, before that I just did cardio and bodyweight exercises. I started this program at 67,5kg, and added 5kg each workout until I reached 95kg.

Before SS I just lifted, tried Skinny Bastard this summer and so on. Didn't really have a routine.

I'm keeping a log for this program, so that's good. I just do the basic SS with Power Cleans with 1 assistance exercise after every basic workout.

[siimon89]

Don't really get it though, I've read that Mehdi and I think Rippetoe as well, both agree on that you usually stall on Overhead or Bench before Squat. I've never stalled on anything on this program before.
Today I did 60x5x3 on power cleans, after that I did the squats and failed (105kg, did 103kg this Monday), then I did 70kgx3x5 bench and 6 pull-ups x 2 which are all new PR.

So how could I finish everything else and get PRs before and after failing squats the same workout?

[Wellhairedbeast]

If you stall on squats before OHP and this especially applies if this has happened twice then there must be something wrong with the form as if rest/food were the issue you would have certainly stalled on OHP first.

[siimon89]

If you stall on squats before OHP and this especially applies if this has happened twice then there must be something wrong with the form as if rest/food were the issue you would have certainly stalled on OHP first.

Interesting. I tried 3 times, but I just kept putting the weight on the rack everytime I bent down. Maybe I accidentally dropped the weight on the safety racks, and it became a "Box Squat" that way.

Since I haven't failed on anything else before these last 4 weeks, and broke PRs before and after the failed squat, should I try this friday with 105kg's and try to think about the form and NOT dropping the weights on the racks? Or should I deload 10% directly?

[Wellhairedbeast]

What do you mean by dropping the weight on the racks? Is this when you fail?

If the bar is hitting the rack each time make sure your not using it to help bounce the barbell back up and gain momentum, and since your hitting the bars at what depth are you squatting?

[siimon89]

What do you mean by dropping the weight on the racks? Is this when you fail?

If the bar is hitting the rack each time make sure your not using it to help bounce the barbell back up and gain momentum, and since your hitting the bars at what depth are you squatting?

Actually, my dad helped me build two solid wooden boxes that I can dump the weights on if I fail. The problem is that I realise they are a bit too high. So when I try to break parallel, I pretty much always hit the boxes.
And today when I crouched down into a squat position, I dipped/dumped the weights on the boxes by accident and from there I couldn't squat up. So I think the problem might be there. Since I did 3x5 103kg this Monday and today I couldn't even do one squat.

I will place something under my feet next time so that I don't hit the boxes when squatting past parallel.

[Wellhairedbeast]

Im not sure if placing something under your feet sounds safe, and if you mean just under your heels then thats not recommended either.

Can you post a video of your squats at all?