is it ok to squat again when sore?

[Mehdi]

You know what the problem is Wildster? The same as with everyone who wants to go against the grain every now & then on this forum: you're not seeing the context. StrongLifts 5x5 is 3x/week, you're starting with an empty bar. You can't overtrain because the weight is too low, you're obviously making strength progress every workout and everyone is adding weight every workout 3x/week for 2-3 months without stalling, check the logs.

seo1 is doing starting strength. I suppose he didn't check his ego and started with a weight too heavy. But even then he should train the muscle again using the slightest increment.

And we're not interested in growing muscles. We're interested in getting stronger. Far easier to check progress accurately. Building muscle/losing fat will be direct byproduct of that. That's what I mean with missing the context. You're talking apples, we're talking oranges.

Possibly I am missing the context, you may be right. Please don't get me wrong I'm not saying that 5x5 is wrong or indending to have a go by any means. I was mearly replying to this thread on what I saw "is it ok to squat again when sore?", which in general for someone who has trained for a constant period of time and no longer is a beginner the answer I'm saying is no not really, make sure you give enough rest for the muscle to grow, possibly tweak the workout slightly to cater for this.

If you give enough time for the muscle to grow then the strength will increase as a result (as you stated). If someone is starting off training a new way then yes they will get sore quicker and for longer and yes it may be OK to train through this, but what I'm saying is that once you have been training over a prolonged period of time you should avoid doing this and ensure enough rest as this will allow the muslce to grow and come back stronger. Like you said it depends on what context something it being talked about in, if that's the case then maybe wer'e at crossed wires, i'm talking apples and you're talking oranges.

Now we get eachother's point of view. I get what you mean. Typical gym go-er training 5times per week doing 100 exercises to failure: yes that will lead to stuff like overtraining, strength going down, etc. Different context than seo1 which just started, so a beginner.

[silentbob]

Now I'm lost. Are we arguing the same point?!

[Wildster]

You know what the problem is Wildster? The same as with everyone who wants to go against the grain every now & then on this forum: you're not seeing the context. StrongLifts 5x5 is 3x/week, you're starting with an empty bar. You can't overtrain because the weight is too low, you're obviously making strength progress every workout and everyone is adding weight every workout 3x/week for 2-3 months without stalling, check the logs.

seo1 is doing starting strength. I suppose he didn't check his ego and started with a weight too heavy. But even then he should train the muscle again using the slightest increment.

And we're not interested in growing muscles. We're interested in getting stronger. Far easier to check progress accurately. Building muscle/losing fat will be direct byproduct of that. That's what I mean with missing the context. You're talking apples, we're talking oranges.

Possibly I am missing the context, you may be right. Please don't get me wrong I'm not saying that 5x5 is wrong or indending to have a go by any means. I was mearly replying to this thread on what I saw "is it ok to squat again when sore?", which in general for someone who has trained for a constant period of time and no longer is a beginner the answer I'm saying is no not really, make sure you give enough rest for the muscle to grow, possibly tweak the workout slightly to cater for this.

If you give enough time for the muscle to grow then the strength will increase as a result (as you stated). If someone is starting off training a new way then yes they will get sore quicker and for longer and yes it may be OK to train through this, but what I'm saying is that once you have been training over a prolonged period of time you should avoid doing this and ensure enough rest as this will allow the muslce to grow and come back stronger. Like you said it depends on what context something it being talked about in, if that's the case then maybe wer'e at crossed wires, i'm talking apples and you're talking oranges.

Now we get eachother's point of view. I get what you mean. Typical gym go-er training 5times per week doing 100 exercises to failure: yes that will lead to stuff like overtraining, strength going down, etc. Different context than seo1 which just started, so a beginner.

Yes I agree in this context in reference to starting strength

[Dada]

Squatting 3x per week with 48 hours between workouts will NEVER lead to overtraining.

Depends on the context, if you're a beginner or new to it then you can get away with training the squat 3 times per week and making gains. If you continue to do it over years then you will soon find that you stop making progress training it hardcore three times per week, and may benefit more to only training it once per week giving more time to ensure enough rest as the intensity and weight increases over time.

You are right about this to a point. One cannot keep squatting 3x per week and keep adding weight each session.

At some point the trainee will need to cross over to the intermediate stage. The trick there is that although the intermediate will still squat 3x per week, they will not go heavy and high volume on each of those sessions.

For example, on most intermediate plans, they would squat heavy on Monday for 5x5, then Wednesday would be a light day (usually 80% of what they used on Monday and for less sets / reps) and Friday would be heavy weight but only 1 heavy set.

Some routines get more complicated than that but you get the gist. Check out the links I posted earlier for a more in depth explanation.

[rbtrout]

Gains when first starting any exercise are oftern quick, however (as most of you will know who have trained for years) these new to the exercise gains soon slow down and are hard to keep going year in year out (especially training this type of heavy duty exercise 3 times per week), doing this will more than oftern be less productive then if you were to leave adequate rest i.e. at least squatting once per week.

This is why programs like SL and SS don't go on for all eternity - they are starting programs. It's incredibly tough to get a beginner to over-train, even training 5-6 days a week. The trainee is told to stay on the program until they stop making gains. Some will be 3 months some will be 6 months, maybe even longer, but once the gains stop coming, switch up the routine.

These programs teach the trainee how to lift with proper form, get used to lifting and build a good foundation to then continue in the weight training path they'd like to, whether it's PRRST, DC, any one of number bb splits, oly lifting and even powerlifting.

[eLvarouza]

Completely off topic: where did you hear Glenn Pendlay is on the gear?

Edit: never mind, just saw it.

[MrWalk]

It has to be only your genetics and not working out 3X a week. Just think if you waited a couple of weeks in between squat sessions how much stronger you could have been.......

I've tried to make my case on this issue politely and in a non advaisive manner, but many seem to not be able to have a discussion and instead mock. However, your response I have quoted is actually a good point (all be it even though you are saying it without being serious). I have studied and tested this and the findings I have produced confirm it. Yes, the person in question may have made gains squatting 3 times per week, but given adequate rest (not extensive rest like most are quoting here) then gains would more than likely be greater.

However this case the person has come from squatting just a bar to body weight in 11 weeks. Gains when first starting any exercise are oftern quick, however (as most of you will know who have trained for years) these new to the exercise gains soon slow down and are hard to keep going year in year out (especially training this type of heavy duty exercise 3 times per week), doing this will more than oftern be less productive then if you were to leave adequate rest i.e. at least squatting once per week.

Bagh. Sorry for the mockery, but it had to be done. I appreciate your opinion, though I'm not sure why such a large amount of it is in this thread. The OP was asking if it was ok to squat again when sore. Some of our "wise old sages" replied "suck it up and drive on," and he said "thanks", and that was that. Then all hell broke loose and it (d)evolved into a discussion with you of the merits of squatting 3x a week and making gains on these programs and what limits you might imagine we have.

I just had to chime in and say it is working for me. I'm no squeaky clean complete beginner like you seem to suggest, nor am I a genetic freak or superhero. I'm 41 years old and have been around the block and the gym a few times. Nonetheless, on Stronglifts I have learned a ton, gained 18lbs, built very obvious muscle and strength all over that I've simply never had before despite previous attempts at it, and continue to progress in linear fashion three times a week after almost 12 weeks. Those facts just seemed to effectively dispel the majority of your rather large point and support the responses you are getting.

Rest as much as you want to. Don't worry about me.

[Wildster]

It has to be only your genetics and not working out 3X a week. Just think if you waited a couple of weeks in between squat sessions how much stronger you could have been.......

I've tried to make my case on this issue politely and in a non advaisive manner, but many seem to not be able to have a discussion and instead mock. However, your response I have quoted is actually a good point (all be it even though you are saying it without being serious). I have studied and tested this and the findings I have produced confirm it. Yes, the person in question may have made gains squatting 3 times per week, but given adequate rest (not extensive rest like most are quoting here) then gains would more than likely be greater.

However this case the person has come from squatting just a bar to body weight in 11 weeks. Gains when first starting any exercise are oftern quick, however (as most of you will know who have trained for years) these new to the exercise gains soon slow down and are hard to keep going year in year out (especially training this type of heavy duty exercise 3 times per week), doing this will more than oftern be less productive then if you were to leave adequate rest i.e. at least squatting once per week.

Bagh. Sorry for the mockery, but it had to be done. I appreciate your opinion, though I'm not sure why such a large amount of it is in this thread. The OP was asking if it was ok to squat again when sore. Some of our "wise old sages" replied "suck it up and drive on," and he said "thanks", and that was that. Then all hell broke loose and it (d)evolved into a discussion with you of the merits of squatting 3x a week and making gains on these programs and what limits you might imagine we have.

I just had to chime in and say it is working for me. I'm no squeaky clean complete beginner like you seem to suggest, nor am I a genetic freak or superhero. I'm 41 years old and have been around the block and the gym a few times. Nonetheless, on Stronglifts I have learned a ton, gained 18lbs, built very obvious muscle and strength all over that I've simply never had before despite previous attempts at it, and continue to progress in linear fashion three times a week after almost 12 weeks. Those facts just seemed to effectively dispel the majority of your rather large point and support the responses you are getting.

Rest as much as you want to. Don't worry about me.

Think I misunderstood the original few posts that the guy was a new starter and I was offering my opinion on training again while sore further down the line when you're been training for years

Think rbtrout sums it up well in his previous post when he states:-

"This is why programs like SL and SS don't go on for all eternity - they are starting programs"

Therefore if you've only been training it for 12 weeks then your gains make sense, this would differ if you had ben doing it for a year or two I'm sure

[MrWalk]

Yep, true that. We just try to keep the message on point here to keep the basics from getting muddled for new folks trying to learn.

The beginner only has this one chance to enjoy these rapid gains and must not half-ass it or miss workouts due to simple soreness, etc. That is the value of this type of routine - building a good foundation quickly while the body is able to adapt and strengthen so rapidly.

[rbtrout]

Wouldn't it be nice to keep newbie gains all along? I bust ass for 3 months to get 5-10 pounds on a lift.

[thunderdownunder]

Years ago I suffered a back injury which incidentally got me back in the gym. I would have all sorts of pain going on during my healing process. My Rehabilitation and Return To Work coordinator would always say '''there's good pain and there's bad pain. Learn to know the difference". In other words listen to and get to know your body. After training for awhile you will know...without any shadow of doubt what the difference is.

[Guillaume31]

Years ago I suffered a back injury which incidentally got me back in the gym. I would have all sorts of pain going on during my healing process. My Rehabilitation and Return To Work coordinator would always say '''there's good pain and there's bad pain. Learn to know the difference". In other words listen to and get to know your body. After training for awhile you will know...without any shadow of doubt what the difference is.

+1 to that and that is a great advice to beginners.
I felt the same soreness after my first SL session (not so long ago ) and a friend told me squatting through the soreness will teach my body i 'want' to squat 3x a week and it needs to heal/recover faster.. given i feed him properly.

Although it wasn't based on any scientific or medical evidence, felt like good advice !

[seo1]

haha seems this thread has started a war!

squatting three times a week and playing full court basketball doesn't really work. i've found twice maybe three times a week doing starting strength has helped me see strength gains while maintaining and increasing my athletic ability.

i had done many of these compound lifts but in the BB rep range. Strength training works better as i work out less, play ball more, and get stronger all at once.

[Kenso]

from what i have gathered through personal experience, soreness is not necessarily due to muscle breaking down and recovering itself. its from a stimulus to the body, a change that the body is NOT used to.

2 weeks ago, me and my friend wrestled for a single 15 minute round. 2 days later when my lift day came around, mostly my entire body was sore, except my legs haha (thanks squats!). the reason i got sore was not because my muscles necessarily broke down like they do everytime i work out, they got sore because i was wrestling, and my body is NOT used to wrestling.

[SupraFast]

It only takes about 24 hours for a muscle to recover. The soarness will go away. You will be fine working through it. When you start to workout and get the legs moving, you won't relaly notice the soarness that much anyway.