is the answer to our problems within?

[pookle]

as i get bigger and bigger, i am still really interested in this subject. the biggest things i've noticed are increased recovery times and higher sex drive. people seem to "like me" more, but that may just be a placebo affect. i make no effort to engage in conversation with anyone at school but people will sometimes talk to me now. i try not to analyze these things anyways.

now, i dont get sore after work outs anymore. even if i do new exercises. last wesdnesday was the first time i did heavy deadlifts (to which i am happy to say i was able to lift 2 plates on each side), but the next day i didnt feel any soreness. before, i would stay sore from bench press or squats for 5-6 days.

here's a cool article i found: http://www.brainmysteries.com/Research/ ... action.asp

It has been assumed that people are attracted to other people because they are drawn to particular types.

But Drs Ben Jones, Lisa DeBruine and Lisa Welling have shown that testosterone levels appear to be the key.

Theirs is the first study to reveal the role the hormone plays in making certain women attractive to certain men.

that makes sense. but maybe we aren't seeing the faces when we look at these girls. maybe we are seeing the testosterone. when u see a huge bodybuilding girl, u think "YUCK!!" but what makes you say this? is it the muscles and general manliness that is a turn off, or is your mind seeing all that testosterone rushing thru her veins, this "sixth sense" that pook talks about, to which my mind says "NO!!!" either way, her un-attractiveness springs off of other actions (acting manly, deep voice, acting tough) which can also be influenced by testosterone, it probably is

and earlier, i had another idea that your testosterone levels might be affected by the type of training, food you eat, and rest/sleep. i was reading articles and found this: http://www.trulyhuge.com/weighttraining ... terone.htm

This research consisted of two groups, one performing an hypertrophy workout made of sets of 10 RM with a minute of rest between each sets.

The other one was a strength training consisting of multiple sets of 5 RM with 3 minutes between each sets.

Both group shown significant increase in serum testosterone, the earlier showing a slightly higher increase.

That indicate that hypertrophy workout do increase testosterone level more than strength training. Also shorter rest periods seem to have the same effect.

Pook did a bodybuilding work out, however the work outs are made for 3 minutes of rest between exercises. still, there are many burn out sets and super sets that give you a real pump. i can definitely say that i can feel the T in my veins during the workouts pook did (anthony ellis work outs). after burn out sets and super sets i feel jittery and jumpy. by the end of work out its hard to work my abs because of the random annoying errections (LOL!!)

also, the meat. pook/anthony ellis always talk about how important meat is. anothony uses whey shakes and such, but pook says he only uses meats because of the testosterone benefits. he also says to not use milk. one of the reasons i dont use milk besides the health risks of pasteurization is all the fat u gain from it, and higher fat means less testosterone and more estrogen. pook/anthony also emphasis a diet which is mostly protein, and thats hard to do with milk

and one more point, perhaps the really important one, why there are so many people who oppose this idea, for example Jerzi. well, as pook describes himself, he is "huge." he is the biggest guy in the gym, bigger than the meat heads and all that. he claims he has met with other forumers from sosuave, and the first thing they always say is "You're huge!" of course, maybe he's lying, but i who knows.

but how many people can claim that they are huge? Jerzi says he was 6'1 190 lbs. and bluestreak is (i think) 225 lbs at 6'5. but what about their bodyfat? 225 lbs with 13% bodyfat is a lot less muscle than 225 with 6% bodyfat. two people can be the same height and have the same measurements, but one guy could be 20 lbs lighter and look ripped if the other guy has a higher bodyfat.

pook claims to have "washboard" abs, which probably explains why he is so "huge" at 6'3 210 lbs, assuming his bodyfat is 6-8%. who knows, maybe the magical pook also has hollow bones, lol.

maybe there is a difference in testosterone levels between people who have 13% bf and 6% bodyfat. right now i'm about 170 lbs at 5'11. i look better in the mirror but the camera never lies. you really dont know how skinny u are until u look at a picture of yoruself. after looking at pics, i'd say i need to get to 230 before i will be considered "huge."

[DJJ]

We all like Pook, but now it looks like you're putting him on a pedestral Pookle, mind you.

Statistics don't say anything about how you look. Some people need to be a lot heavier, stronger and muscular than others to be considered 'huge'. You shouldn't take Pook's advise on weightlifting to seriously. He is all about being a man, following your biological nature and not making an academic study of life. So he just picked a program he thought might work, worked hard, ate a proteine rich diet, slept well et voiola, he got huge. He doesn't take weightlifting to seriously. In fact, he might not even like weightlifting. For him, it was just a means to an end. He wanted to become a man and get lucky with the ladies because he felt he was limited by his skinny appearence. He followed his path and we should follow our own. His advise is based on what worked for him and what he thought was best for him. Hell he might even advise those things because desperate males kept pestering with questions like ''How can I become just as huuuuge as you Pook so I get all the ladies to?'' Do what you think is right, follow your own dreams, set your own goals in life and don't overanalyze, especially don't overanalyze Pook himself.

I do think being huge is an advantage and I do believe it turns women's heads. However, if you lack in the inner game department, you will never notice because in that case women would rather die than letting you they like your body. Pook is right when he says that skinny guys can get plenty of women too, he doesn't deny that fact, but he adds that you're still limited. Skinny guys don't have the power to attract girls by just standing there doing nothing and ignoring girls, but when you're huge, they will come and get you. And I never, ever saw a skinny guy with that kind of power. Come to think of it, I never saw any guy with that kind of power. Maybe the story of Pook is just a myth to empower the desperate male reading his posts. The Don Juan lives in stories, not in your neighbourhood.

[Cleave]

I had to revive this thread and make a comment after an experience I had last night.

I met some buddies for beers for a friends 45th birthday last night. Just a sports bar, not a club. I'm not sure what was going on but the waitress was all over me; talkative and hanging out by me all night and some of the other girls were coming around as well. Keep in mind I'm a middle aged guy with a wedding ring.

I know that I'm looking better, and as we all know with strength comes confidence. I think, maybe subconsciously, that I carry myself differently than before. I know I'm more relaxed and comfortable wherever I am. When I was a fat-ass I wore dark baggy clothes and sunk into corners and tried to blend in and not get noticed. I wore sweaters hoping to cover up my belly. Now I wear jeans that fit and shirts that show off the guns. Getting back to the post by Pook about getting bigger; sure, I do agree he got more attention going from skinny to big (and don't forget he's pretty tall which doesn't hurt) but don't forget about the confidence that comes as you get bigger and stronger. You may not be trying to pick anybody up or think your doing anything different, but your body language will exude confidence without you even trying.

Cleave

[WillJG]

In my opinion, all of this simply boils down to how you view yourself. It would make sense that you act in a way which reflects your opinion of yourself, right? I mean, if you hate playing football for example, you won't play football. You don't play football, and everyone can see that you don't. They can infer that you don't like playing football. If they only like people who play football, then they will not like you.

Now, if you extend that concept to other things, such as confidence, it's displayed by, for example, the way you carry yourself, the condition of the clothes you wear, how well you care for your hair...but these things are only effects. They're cues for observers, caused by your actions (such as your decision to dress nicely). They tell the observer things about you. Obviously if an observer infers that you don't think much of yourself, they're not very likely to think much of you if they don't know you because that's all they have to go on. This is why first impressions are so very important; university interviewers are notorious for basing whether or not a student gets a place largely on their appearence, for these reasons.

Basically the idea I'm getting at here is as follows: you make a judgement of someone based on the limited information you recieve from them when you first meet them, and you're the only person who can provide that information to onlookers. So basically, the way people see you is directly tied to how you see yourself. If you do something, such as weight lifting, which improves your opinion of yourself then that will also improve the way other people see you. Big muscles don't make people like you...the only thing that makes people like you is the way you act.

[Mehdi]

I still believe you're missing an important point: being in shape can work against you too.

You're a good looking guy, have great hair, hip
clothes, flashy car, you're successful in business
and you know all the right people; you even have
no noticeable, nervous twitching.

Let's say that none of this is over the top and
you're not using all these things as crutches.
Basically, you think you have your act together.

So why do you still have problems attracting
women, holding the attraction and getting them not
to flake? Even after they've shown initial
interest by approaching you, telling you they're
interested and getting together with you for
mind-blowing physical activity? I bet you never
thought that you might have it TOO together for
them.

Here's what I mean:

You might be too perfect. Women want to nurture
and fix you. When they're with you they try to
imagine where they would fit into your life and
what they would help you with. You've provided
them with nothing to fix...you're ALREADY fixed.
You might also be doing something relationship
oriented that's giving them the 'go signal' to
have those thoughts in the first place. Women
rarely do that with me. They know the deal and
don't consider any other possibilities.

Here are a couple of other reasons directly from
women:

* 'You are a good looking guy, its because we're
afraid we'll get hurt, its a defense mechanism we
have because we have been burned so many times.'

* 'I really like you and I like being around you,
but I am moving so I am trying my best NOT to see
you, I am sorry I am just scared.'

Believe it!

This is not a lack of attraction but you might be
scaring them; they're actually intimidated by you.
All this time you actually had higher status.

The good news is that you're much more powerful
and attractive than you originally thought. It
makes total sense that they would fear you.
Remember, the hotter they are, the lower their
self-esteem and the average looking men they date
cheat on them less (they think). Whereas with
you, they assume that every woman feels as THEY do
around you so you must get physical with all of
them and they're threatened by this.

What to do?

Relax a little and go out looking a little like
you just got out of bed once in a while.

Try it and let me know what happens!

[hazmat]

Pookle....just some food for thought. Before I started working out, way before I discovered this site and SL, I weighed 250lbs at 5'6". I had not always been that big and heavy, but I was never "a skinny guy" nor was I ever a massive, hulking ball of testosterone. But you know what? I met women...all the time. I dated them, bedded them(not bragging...there are no notches in my headboard or my belt)..I'm just saying that it's not necessarily about what you look like. The reason I was able to talk to women, date them and everything else was because ...wait for it... I'D TALK TO THEM!!! I'd pay attention to what they had to say, I'd laugh if they said something funny, I'd compliment them if I took notice of something about them I particularly liked...most of all, I was confident with myself even if I had a beer gut.

I eventually got really involved with a woman, loved her like I've never loved another woman in my life. When we split up, it crushed me and to an extent took away that confidence I did have. I felt alot like the way you described in your first post and in subsequent posts on this thread. I had to re-learn how to be confident all over again. I basically had to re-tool the way I thought. I had to remember who I was. Took me a while, and it took the help of some friends egging me along, took me ballsing up and getting over the fear of rejection that was still like an open wound on my ego, but I eventually did get past it and got back to talking to women again. Got back to being the person I've always been. And getting back to being that person had NOTHING AT ALL to do with lifting weights. I did that because I wanted to be able to breathe after hiking up a flight of steps.

What I'm telling you this for is....drum roll, please....it IS all about YOU. You can read stuff, lift weights, eat a certain way, wear some chicky-smelling cologne, buy designer clothes, all this bullshit. But if you're not willing to laugh a little, live a little, dance sometimes if the mood strikes you, sorry cousin, you're going to miss out on a whole bunch of stuff. You don't need lines or smooth moves. You just need to let the personality out and show women/people a genuine person and things will start sorting themselves out. But genuine is key. If all you're aiming for is "getting laid" you're going to lose. Besides, the cats that are just out trying to get some ass are most times the biggest douchebags you'll ever want to meet. So, that's my 2 cents on the thing. Hope it helps some.

[guru]

Good point Mehdi, understood.

I think the point underlying what I was trying to say is that a situation you find yourself in cannot make you unhappy or miserable unless you choose to let it. Within reason it is possible to choose how you act and react in any given situation and if you go along with someone else's request, and then are determined to be unhappy and not enjoy it because of your preconceptions of that activity, you will be unhappy. Your reality becomes what you think, as you put it.

On the other hand, if you agree you do something but decide to enjoy it anyway, since you're there, you can do so. A situation is only a sacrifice if you choose to see it that way. It could just be an unexpected treat, depending upon your disposition during the 'family visit' or whatever. You could get something really positive from the visit that you couldn't have forseen, like a job offer, gift etc. The chances of a positive outcome would be reduced if you went with the negative attitude.

With the sex example, if you have fostered an attitude where you 'don't care what happens' you wouldn't be pissed about the refusal, you would just take the opportunity to get extra sleep instead or do something else. It's not the end of the world and could be an opportunity if you choose to see it that way. Maybe you go downstairs and call up an old friend for a chat, which you wouldn't have done otherwise and that has a great outcome, even if you just make each other laugh for a while.

There's a lot of stuff here markg, we need a bar to discuss this

Hell, I would like to join in too. Mehdi, I have read all of Richard Bach's books (am a great fan of his) n times over. He says the same thing in one of his books - "ILLUSIONS". He says "You are free to do whatever you want to do". When I read it first I thought it was weird, but he explains it very well there & it's damn well true.

[markg]

I haven't read any by Bachs. Can you recommend one to start with guru?

[Zero]

Funny thing, I have seen somewhat of a change in myself, but more of a change in others. I used to be fine behind a computer as pookle said, and I still am, however I think it's easier to be "sociable" because people see me differently, and treat me differently. Weight lifting taught me, among other things, confidence, work ethic, and how to control my ego by showing me that I have limits, so in that light, I guess I have changed. But most importantly, how other people treat me has changed the most.

For example, I remember back in middle school (7th grade), there was this girl that was part of the popular crowd, blond hair, cute, smart, etc etc. She never talked to me, looked at me, and I know for a fact that she thought that she was above me. Now, 4 years later I'm a junior in high school (11th grade) and she's in some of my classes and will be in a college-level art class that with me next year (our school has a great art program, and all of the art kids are close friends.) Anyway, her and I now have a great friendship, go to art exhibits together etc., and before she wouldn't go near me, now we put our arms around each other like we've been friends for years.

I still like sitting behind my computer reading about things, or I've been reading a lot of books lately, or drawing/painting by myself, but changing my body from pudgy to fit has changed the way people perceive me, thus the way they treat me, thus the way I am able to socialize. Also, the sitting and reading by myself is just one side of me, the side that likes learning new things. Becoming fit has allowed me to express the sociable side of me.

Also, I believe that the work ethic and discipline that weight lifting taught me hasn't changed me so much as it has built me up and improved upon who I used to be, and shaped me into who I am now, so to speak.

[guru]

I haven't read any by Bachs. Can you recommend one to start with guru?

Start with Jonathan Livingston Seagull. Small book, first one to make him famous. It's actually built around a metaphor. Next try Illusions, The Bridge Across Forever, One. I will look up more for you later.

Well, just try & let me know if you liked him.

[markg]

Just ordered the Seagull one! Cheers.