Knee frustration

[racalvert]

Hi all...

I just recently discovered stronglifts.com and I am very excited and motivated to begin. Unfortunately my excitement is diluted by the fact that I have extreme knee pain doing anything resembling a squat movement. Most of the time I can't even sit down in a chair without supporting myself with my arms, or just sort of falling into the seat. Oddly enough, I am very active in triathlon training and am able to bike for hours and run up to 8 miles with no knee pain.

I spent quite a few years considerably overweight, and I am guessing the extra pounds has killed my knees. I did visit a -supposed- top-notch orthopedist, who simply told me that "I was getting old" (I was about 33 at the time). I currently live and work on a very remote island in the pacific and do not have the luxury of being able to visit a specialist... well, inexpensively anyway. I'm about a $2000 flight from Honolulu. Anyway, it's painfully obvious that I need to see a doctor about my knees, but it will be at least a year before I can. I stupidly just returned from a trip to the states and did not see a specialist.

So anyway, I want to get serious about strength training and Stronglifts 5x5 seems to be exactly what I have been looking for. I'm so frustrated that my knees are going to keep me from doing the most important exercise in the plan. I'm not sure about deadlifts yet. My knee pain had been helped by glucosamine/chondroitin, but in another act of stupidity I quit taking it when I was off the island for my vacation. I can REALLY feel the difference. I started taking again this week.

As much as I want to do the squats, it's just not going to happen any time soon (if ever). It's not a matter of proper technique or form. Heck, I can't even do an air squat without almost falling down in pain. Any advice, experience, or other sage wisdom anyone can pass along to me?

[NoGood]

I suggest doing some lightweight leg extensions or something. It sounds like it's a rough cartilage on the inside of your knee cap and you should just try to "scratch" it off by moving your bone. A friend of mine has the same problem and can't do squats or deadlifts properly, but have no problems swimming, running or bicycling. Obviously you should go about this carefully and if you begin to see some recovery, try doing armsupported squats.

EDIT: This was what his physiotherapist suggested.

[Mehdi]

Read this:
http://stronglifts.com/squats-knee-pain/

Most people feel better once they start squatting. Start with empty bar, use correct technique, be patient. I wouldn't do leg extensions at all, tends to cause knee pain rather than prevent it.

[Cleave]

Can you give us a little more detail about your pain?

I'm 43 and have some bad knees. I too was over weight for many years and have battled a lot of mobility problems in order to progress with my strength training. My right knee has a cadaver ACL and was replaced about 10 years ago and is doing ok but my left knee is just weak. I did discuss it with my Dr and he didn't think I needed to do anything about it just yet. I just seem to have some stretched tendons that make my knee a little weak. It wants to move around on me during squats if my form is not right. What he suggested is to strengthen it. I bicycle two or three days a week (swimming would be good) and I do a very long and thorough warmup before I do any squats. I do 20min on a treadmill, then 10 body weight squats, then 10 bar only, then 10 with 95lbs...you get the picture.

Take your time and focus on form. Do body weight squats and lunges and make sure you warm up properly. You may be able to overcome some of your knee pain by taking your time and building up your strength.


Cleave

[DavidC]

Hi, I thought I'd share my knee progress. I hope you find this a positive post!

I am 43 (lol at "getting old" at 33 in racalvert’s post), and in February 2008 I snapped my left ACL (cruciate ligament) during Krav Maga training. It was one of those silly things, training getting a bit heated, body weight goes to the wrong place, foot slips abit…pop. I heard it pop as it snapped. I had reconstructive surgery from hamstrings in April 2008. Then I did lots of physio (mainly on my own in the gym) but obviously under guidance from a trained physio.

Late 2008 I decided to go beyond physio and do “Body for life” weight training. It was OK, but it didn’t really do it for me for a number of reasons. I then read about Mehdi’s Stronglifts 5x5 (via the myprotein forums where Stronglifts 5x5 was highly rated). I looked at Mehdi’s programme, and I thought…”well Stronglifts looks great….but nope it’s not for me as it’s too heavy on the squats, and my knees can’t take it”. And so I carried on not doing very much in the gym, or with very little focus, avoiding Stronglifts due to the focus on squats and other compound exercises such as deadlift, and then eventually I came back to Stronglifts 5x5.

I’m about two months in now on Stronglifts 5x5 and have taken it very gradually, but today I squatted 72½ Kg. That’s almost my body weight! I never thought I’d do that!!! I know that’s not a huge amount of weight for a squat, but I too was in a similar position to you racalvert not that long ago. For me I thought my knee had had it, and my training was going to be limited. Imho there’s no need for your knees to stop you getting into Stronglifts !!! If you do decide to go for it, make sure you get some guidance on technique, and that you are doing exercises absolutely correctly, and you start low on the weights, and you warm up properly. That's what I did and no problem so far. Of course, we're all different, and what works for me may not work for you.

To be honest, I don’t worry about my knees at all now, who knows if I will get concerned as the weight goes higher, but right now I have no problems or concerns at all.

The benefits? Last week I ran properly outside (as opposed to running on a treadmill) for the first time post-op. Before that it was a painful 25 yard (maximum) hobble. I used to feel pain sometimes in the knee, just at my desk or in bed, or whatever - just doing normal things. Now, I don’t feel any pain in the knee at all, and to be honest the only reminder of my operation is the scar on my knee and the slight protrusion where the screw was fitted. There no pain and I can run again! Fantastic. This definitely came from training on Mehdi’s Stronglifts 5x5.

If you do decide to go for it, just make sure you get lots of guidance…and go for it (slowly)! It's been good for me. Good luck.

Cheers David

[Dada]

I got one bad knee also. Squatting has actually been the best thing for it as long as form is perfect.

[racalvert]

"Did you read and execute my instructions thoroughly?"

Working in IT the last 10+ years I have asked users and other IT workers that question a million times. Today I finally used it on myself.

After all of the reading and searching I have done on this website and forum, I finally asked myself that question. I went to the gym today determined to focus on form and, to my extreme shock and surprise, was able to do 5x5 squats WITH the 45 lb bar AND no knee pain! I can't even begin to describe how excited this made me. It was just a matter of having the guts to give it a shot and concentrating on proper form. The 2 biggest things for me today: 1) Keeping my heels on the floor, and, 2) squatting below parallel. I actually have more knee pain when NOT squatting past parallel, which really sort of boggles my mind. I guess it's related to the fact that the knee is strongest at each extreme (flexed and straight)... just like the instructions say.

Guys I appreciate your feedback and patience with my skepticism. Thanks for the encouragement!

-Alan

[Mehdi]

"Did you read and execute my instructions thoroughly?"

Working in IT the last 10+ years I have asked users and other IT workers that question a million times. Today I finally used it on myself.

After all of the reading and searching I have done on this website and forum, I finally asked myself that question. I went to the gym today determined to focus on form and, to my extreme shock and surprise, was able to do 5x5 squats WITH the 45 lb bar AND no knee pain! I can't even begin to describe how excited this made me. It was just a matter of having the guts to give it a shot and concentrating on proper form. The 2 biggest things for me today: 1) Keeping my heels on the floor, and, 2) squatting below parallel. I actually have more knee pain when NOT squatting past parallel, which really sort of boggles my mind. I guess it's related to the fact that the knee is strongest at each extreme (flexed and straight)... just like the instructions say.

Guys I appreciate your feedback and patience with my skepticism. Thanks for the encouragement!

-Alan

Great to hear that!

[ricepower]

Congrats Alan keep at it.

I also had a bad knee injury at the beginning of march, my leg became painful and swollen for 2 weeks, and my knee made loud cracking noises.

The more I left it the more painful and immobile it became. So I continued to cycle & squat, the more I squatted the better it felt. Now in June, my knee has no pain and is fully mobile thanks to squatting 3xweek. However it still creaks/crackles, and If I miss a squat session then stiffness/instabilty/pain returns. Squatting is definetley good for knees (below parallel of course)

[bear38]

I think when when the thighs are parallel to the floor, the tendons are most stressed compared to other 'levels', and that's where the knee pain comes from IMO, if we don't squat below parallel. So, anyway, my left knee is hurting and it's been a month or so (I play volleyball a lot by the way). If I press gently, I can tell that the one injured is my tendon which connects the kneecap with quadriceps. Is there any suggestion to recover the injured tendon? (other than rest..I have tried stopping any kind of sports for one week and there was no effect)